- Hello, we are still broadcasting live from the Forum Entreprendre de la Culture
here in Nantes (France)
and I'm together with Paolo Montemurro.
- Hi.
- Paulo you just held a workshop about this creative project canvas.
You're going to be telling us a bit more about.
But first please tell us a bit more about yourself and where you work.
- Okay.
I am the Director of MateraHub.
MateraHub is an organization that is supporting
creative and cultural industries in the South of Italy,
actually in a city that will be next year European Capital of Culture,
the city of Matera.
- Right, and how did you come up with the idea of this canvas?
- This canvas has been developed in the framework of a European project.
So European Commission funded us to work together
with partners from seven other countries.
And Nantes was represented by someone in the partnership.
The focus of the project
was to give to the cultural and creative sector representatives
better entrepreneurial competences,
so to help them develop those skills to make their work more sustainable,
their project more sustainable from an economic point of view.
- Right, and this reminds me of the Business Model Canvas.
- Correct.
- what is often called BMC.
It is widely used for startups to describe their business model.
Why did you feel you had to come up
or what was the reason you wanted to come up with a different model
and how is it better for a cultural project
and what was wrong with the other one?
- Well actually correct.
We started from the Business Model Canvas.
But when we wanted to talk with artists and cultural operators
about business, about economy
and we were using terminology coming from the Business Model Canvas
they were scared.
So for them it was very difficult to accept the economic vocabulary.
So first of all we did the work of translation.
We started to use a terminology that was more close
to the idea of culture and artistic project.
And then we liked the idea of the canvas which is very visual
and gives the possibility to just work on blocks.
The canvas is a very useful tool to help them
to reflect on their projects from the past, from the present
and maybe for the future.
And the idea was that we needed to give them a very simple tools.
We have to give them workshops where there was a lot of interaction
for them to talk about topics like "how to make your project sustainable".
And this was the best way to make it more accessible for them,
It was the best way to make them really involved in what we wanted to do
because a traditional training wouldn't have worked with them.
- You're talking about sustainability.
Does it mean that money and profits are less important in this canvas.
- Well we are talking about values that for cultural, artistic and creative project
are very important.
That can be also related to the financial values
but it involves a lot of social things, involves a lot of emotional elements.
So for artists and cultural people there are some other elements
that guide their work which are not necessarily connected to finance.
Of course finance and sustainability is very important.
- Yes, because even artists have to eat, right ?
- Yeah, they have to survive if we want them to have the right competences
to develop projects that could be more sustainable
and able to develop economy.
And now we are talking a lot about how cultural and creative industries
are growing in Europe and how they are creating jobs.
So it's very important to give them
the financial and structural solidity to do this.
- So I see for instance that in the traditional Business Model Canvas
here we have cost structure and here we have revenue streams
and in this model, here we can really see,
we have short-term gains and losses
and here long-term rewards.
So what we typically go there?
- This is actually one of the most difficult part of the canvas
because in our time it's very difficult to think
of something that will happen in one year.
And so we try to focus on what benefit could come from a project
in the long term perspective that maybe are not connected to revenues,
financial revenues that can get immediately,
but are more related to a project that can have a vision in the future.
So we want them to think a little more
on how the things that they are doing today can have an impact in the future,
maybe in two years, three years
and all the canvas is based on a self reflection or on a group reflection activity.
So we give them the space and the time to really think of what they are doing,
how they do things with the people around them
and also the impact that what they do have in the community.
- So it is a canvas that is just meant for working.
I see all these posted here.
So people come up with ideas and the best parts
and then they take the old ones off
and that's how the projects are all, right
or is there a way to fill it there?
- Well as for the traditional canvas,
usually there are different areas where you can start.
Of course we like to start from the values
because we think they are very very important
for the cultural and creative sectors.
But the result,
so this area that is related to the impact of the activities with the others,
so the people that give us feedbacks
or people that support
or are critics in center point of view
And now the cultural work and the project are accessible for others.
So how open are the things that we are doing.
This part is more traditional.
It's like the time needed, the action needed,
the resources needed to do things
but always the approach is not to just list them.
It's to reflect because we want at the end of a session
to have the people to be able to keep on working on a project
or just say "OK, this is not what I have to do now.
There are some much better things that I can do".
And we want people to start work together
because our workshop is always a way for the creative community of a place
to be together.
Maybe they don't know each other
and when they come to our workshop
it's the first opportunity for them to build cooperation.
- OK.
I have one, well actually I have two last questions for you.
The next two last one is who comes to your workshops
and what type of cultural enterprises come to you for advice and guidance?
Does it apply to any type of cultural activity.
- The artistic, cultural and creative sector is very wide.
We like to work more with artists and cultural organization
rather than the creative world
because if you think at video game developer,
they are much more oriented toward a start-up.
So they have a business model that is more for the traditional canvas.
- It's more an industry.
- Yeah, it's an industry,
they talk about profit, they talk about investors.
Cultural Enterprise do not have people that want to invest on them.
Think about a theater company which is a company
because has employees and pay taxes,
but they need of course a certain sustainability
and they need to think of themselves as a company.
So we work a lot with artists,
we work a lot with cultural organization,
we work a lot with managers, cultural managers
that want to facilitate the process.
So we train them in order to use the canvas with other people
so that they can help us multiply the effects of the canvas.
- So now my last question to you.
Let's say in our viewers they're people who might be interested in this tool.
So how would they be able to approach it?
Is there a website? Is it free to download?
Do you hold workshops through friends?
How does it work?
- First thing, very easy,
www.creativeprojectcanvas.com .
It's the website where they can download the canvas for free
and they can download a manual which helps them in playing with the canvas.
We called it the work playbook
because there is also some gaming involved of course.
- Serious gaming.
- Serious gaming, yes, yes.
And the other thing is that we try as much as possible
to organize local workshops.
So from time to time we have the possibility to travel
around Europe of our partners organized workshops.
So there is a list of organisation in Europe that do this.
And the other things of course is in Creative Commons.
So open license and we like people to adopt it.
And this is just an anticipation for the future.
We are working on the creative project canvas
for the internationalization of cultural organization.
So how to access international networks.
- Okay, so maybe we'll see you again for the next steps of this canvas.
Thank you a lot Paolo for sharing your thoughts with us
and enjoy your day in Nantes.
- I will. - See you soon.
- OK, thank you. - Bye.
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