You may be seated.
Hello, Your Honor.
Hello.
This is the case of Degree v. Little.
Thank you, Jerome.
Good day, everyone.
AUDIENCE: Good day.
Ms. Degree, you say your whole world changed
when you were just nine years old
and your mother revealed to you that your dad
was not your biological father.
She then told you Mr. Little was your father,
yet claimed he's denied you ever since.
JASMINE: Yes, Your Honor.
Mr. Little, you say you are 100% certain
you are not her father.
Yes, Your Honor.
JUDGE LAKE: Though you admit you were intimate with her mother,
you are certain it was months before she became pregnant.
Yes, Your Honor.
Ms. Felicia Degree, you are the plaintiff's mother.
Yes, Your Honor.
You argue that you told Mr. Little
he was your daughter's father,
yet he has rejected her ever since.
Yes, Your Honor.
AUDIENCE: Wow!
JUDGE LAKE: So, Ms. Degree, take me back
to when you first found out
Mr. Little may be your biological father.
Well, I was about nine years old.
Me and all my siblings was in the living room.
We was discussing fathers, and that's when my mom told me
who I believed was my biological father,
who had been in my life since I was younger, wasn't,
and she told me that Mr. Little was.
So when I was about 11 years old,
I got his number off a family member
that's married to his family member,
and I called him up on the phone...
JUDGE LAKE: When you were 11?
When I was 11.
And I told him who I was,
who my mother was, and what I believed.
And he told me that he don't know,
he need a DNA test, he don't think so, and...
JUDGE LAKE: Mr. Little, you told an 11-year-old
you needed a DNA test?
LITTLE: Yes, I did.
Straight to an 11-year-old?
Yes, I did.
Wow, tell me your recollection of that call.
She called my house, my wife answered the phone.
I didn't know who she was.
She says she's Ms. Degree's daughter,
"You might be my father."
I don't know who she is.
I was, like, "I don't know if you is or you're not.
We need to take a test to find out."
JUDGE LAKE: Did you know who she was?
No, I didn't know who she was.
This is my first time seeing her.
I ain't know nothing about her.
And so you just decided just to talk about
a DNA test with a child?
When she asked me that I might be her father, I was, like...
JUDGE LAKE: She said "might."
She said... No, I'm... "You my father."
She said, "You are my father."
I don't believe I said that.
You said, "My mother told me you're my father."
So I was like, "Listen, I don't know if you is or you not.
"We need to tell... We need to take a test."
Ms. Degree, so during this time,
did you know she was gonna make that call?
No, I actually didn't, I didn't know she was gonna...
What was your reaction when you found out she did?
When I found out she made the call,
I wasn't even angry at her.
I was more angry at Mr. Little
for telling her that he don't think that he's her father,
to an 11-year-old, when you could've just told her,
"I feel like me and your mom should discuss this,"
instead of telling an 11-year-old that.
Why didn't you call me and tell me that?
Why did she have to call?
I made the choice to call you, but...
If she told you that I might be your father,
she should've called and said, "Listen,
"we need to get together and get on this right here,"
instead of letting a child call me and say you my...
But since she didn't and you being a grown man...
When I got pregnant, I called you and told you...
And you also told my brother.
You told me that it was not yours.
All right, let's get some order.
Everyone, let's get some order.
She told my brother...
Let's get some order.
Did you ever know she was pregnant?
I knew she was pregnant.
That's when she told my brother that it wasn't mine.
My brother said, "Is this my...
Is this gonna be my nephew or niece?"
"No, it ain't your brother's."
Okay, I'm fine with it.
Well, if she told you that, then why are you trying...
It's funny, you don't remember it coming from me...
Hold up, I got a little proof right here
that we messed around in August.
She tell me in November.
What is that, Mr. Little?
A little proof right here.
Let me see.
When we messed around.
You got a calendar from 24 years ago? Wow.
Hey, listen, baby, I do my homework.
I don't even keep a calendar from last year,
but you got a calendar from 24 years ago.
Hey, dig, I do my homework.
Sure, you right.
All right.
So, Mr. Little, what you did
is you created a calendar to illustrate...
I made... I created a calendar to illustrate,
but three months later, she tell me
she pregnant a month later.
I don't know if she Houdini or what.
How do you come up three months later as pregnant?
Let me walk through your evidence.
On the first page, you say
you saw Ms. Degree in November.
LITTLE: We messed around.
And she told you
she was one month pregnant at that time.
Yes, she did.
So you remember that from 24 years ago?
JUDGE LAKE: But now, on the second page of your calendar,
you claim that you were intimate with her in August,
which was just three months earlier.
So therefore, you know
that wasn't the window of conception...
LITTLE: There you go.
If she's one month pregnant in November.
DEGREE: Can I say something, Your Honor?
JUDGE LAKE: Yes, what would you like to add?
If you so-called believe,
and if my mom said it wasn't yours,
why are you searching for me, so-called...
If I am your child?
Why I'm searching for you...
Why, though?
Hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up.
The reason why I'm searching...
The reason why I'm searching for you
because I got a little evidence right here.
If they start taking stuff out my check, I'm call...
I want to take a DNA test 'cause I want to get it stopped.
COREY DEGREE: $12.
$12? You crazy?
JUDGE LAKE: Let me see that evidence, sir.
FELICIA: That's what you should've did.
$12? Come on, bro, you wasn't even there.
What are you talking about $12, man?
COREY: That's my sister, I was there for everything.
JUDGE LAKE: So tell me.
How did you find out you were on child support, if this...
I'm at work, HR came to me and said,
"We got a garnishment, you need to call this number."
I call this number, they tell me
they taking money out for Ms. Degree.
I'm trying to figure out what's going on.
It's not my child, she done told me twice it wasn't mine.
Now, she got me on child support, so what's going on?
But my feeling is if you were so adamant
that wasn't your child and they was taking money out your check,
you should've wanted a blood test then.
Hold up, I got that too, baby, I got that too.
That figures.
Hold up, I got this right here, from the court.
When I went to the court
and they tried to get in contact with her for a DNA test,
she never showed up, and I paid...
I was on the census, they know where I was at.
And I paid for two tests that they never showed up for.
You got that from Rite-Aid.
Okay, let's... Let's get some order.
They didn't have to find me.
That $20 test ain't doing nothing.
No, they would've wanted their money...
So they would've made sure that you got a paternity test.
I came out of...
(GAVEL BANGING)
JASMINE: Can I say something, Your Honor?
Let's get some order.
There you go.
So Mr. Little, you did or did not show up
for this hearing to have genetic testing?
I showed up... I'm the one that asked for it,
and they never got in contact with them
or they never showed up to take the test.
JUDGE LAKE: So when you went to court, no one showed.
No one showed.
And then what happened to your case at that point?
They threw it out 'cause they never showed up.
And so, the garnishment...
Stopped.
Well, the reason why they obviously stopped it,
in my estimation, is because you two didn't show.
Well, I was in a whole 'nother state.
But no, my point is is, they don't usually stop a garnishment.
Once they're getting it, they don't usually stop it
unless they have good cause.
My question is were you ever notified
that this hearing was going to exist
where you needed to appear?
No, Your Honor, 'cause I would've appeared.
And so, when you were asked to give a name...
You know, when you went on assistance,
you were asked to give a name.
Yes, I was.
Did you give only his name, or were there multiple people?
No, I gave Cannon Little name.
LITTLE: It should've been multiple names.
Yeah, okay.
Multiple names.
You know how you was doing back then, girl.
Oh, please, you didn't even know me back then.
Come on now.
JUDGE LAKE: So, ma'am.
Sure you right.
Ma'am, the first man that you told...
LITTLE: That's why you told 'em...
The first man that you told your daughter
was her biological father up until she was nine.
Did you give his name to the court,
or 'cause you always knew he wasn't her...
No, I always knew he wasn't.
But he was there... We were together for years,
so he was doing the responsibility
that Mr. Little should've been doing.
Why didn't you tell her then that...
That somebody else your dad?
Why you had her believing that he was her dad,
then years later, she's nine years old,
you're gonna tell her I'm her dad?
And granted, that's my fault,
but see, me being an adult,
I can accept that and take that.
But you being an adult and claim the fact
that you never took care of her,
you sitting here, you sounding stupid.
I ain't sound...
You sound stupid,
talking about, "Oh, I had multiple this and that."
You did!
Truthfully, you didn't even know who I was.
You didn't know me.
We slept together once!
Yeah, we was at a... We was at a club.
Yeah, bang, bang.
Couple times.
And it... What that was?
All right, all right, all right, hold on, hold on, hold on,
hold on, hold on, let's bring it down a notch.
Let's bring it down a notch.
And matter of fact...
Let's bring it down a notch.
It's getting disrespectful now,
and ultimately, you're talking about the encounter
that created this beautiful, young girl.
So if you don't respect the situation,
at least respect her enough to have some decorum.
Now, Ms. Degree, you've been trying to have...
That's what I'm sayin'.
You've been trying to say something,
but I needed to understand this and this evidence.
What would you like to add?
I would like to say he said he been searching
or whatever like that 'cause of the child support.
And I'm not saying he is my father.
I'm not saying he not, I'm just here to find out
if he is or if he not.
But I was 11...
And that's what you were told.
Exactly, and I was 11 years old,
and it took me five minutes to get in contact with him.
Five minutes, so you telling me
it took you 21 years to find me?
How was it that hard? So you must've not been searching.
Our... Our family members is married.
Our family members is married, so how can it be
that hard to get in contact with me because...
Why should I get in contact?
I did it like this.
Because you wanted child support to stop, right?
When your mother told me from the beginning you're not my child.
Well, why did you try to get...
I'm gonna go like that.
Okay, he said why should he look for me?
But he just recently contacted me in 2011, July 29th.
To take a test.
Exactly, 'cause you said,
"I want to know what's going on.
"And then, we can go from there.
I just want to know if you my child."
Why do you want to know if I am but I'm not?
You're a grown man, and just to know that
it's a responsibility out there
that could be yours because obviously...
Obviously, you thought I was a possibility
'cause you came back to look for me.
How could you leave something out there
that you believe is yours
and just not even want to find out?
Let me ask you something.
How?
Being a grown man... Being a grown man, though?
Didn't I reach out to you and ask you to take a test?
I was a child, and I acted like an adult to find you, right?
But when you got older, didn't I reach out to you
and say, "Let's take a test to find out?"
COREY: That was for child support.
It wasn't for child... Let's find out.
It was for child support, but we still need to find out.
So Ms. Degree, though, explain to this... This gentleman.
I'm being generous, sir, 'cause you crossing the line now.
You're a little bit... You're a little bit...
A little bit aggressive to this young woman.
She's a strong young woman, so I'm letting her hold her own,
but it's taking all of my maternal instincts.
You need to bring it down a notch
because ultimately, she's only acting off
of what she was told.
Now, Ms. Degree, I would like for you
to explain to Mr. Little, in your own words,
what was that like after you got that news?
I was kinda distraught.
It's, like, how could you say that to a child?
That's not none of my business.
Whatever happened with him and my mom,
all that argument that's going on now,
I don't have nothing to do with that.
I don't even care for the argument.
I'm just the child conceived.
All I want to know is what's going on.
What's going on... Are you?
I'm not coming here, I'm not blaming him.
I'm not saying you are, you wrong for not taking care of me.
I'm not saying none of that because I...
I might not be, so I'm not blaming him,
saying he's wrong or nothing, I just want to know.
I'm coming here as an adult.
I tried to reach out to you as a kid,
but now I'm coming as an adult...
To see if you are, and you're acting very childish.
Like, come on, now.
We can both be grown.
We can be grown here.
We coming here for one answer, one answer.
You submitted photos to the court.
So this is you at 11 years old on the left.
And then, on the right is...
JASMINE: Mr. Little.
JUDGE LAKE: At age 12.
And so Mr. Little, when you see the photo,
do you see any resemblance?
No, just a little bit, I don't...
The nose, that's about it, you know?
Ms. Degree, you've brought a witness.
I'd like to hear from him.
Please stand, sir,
and please stand at the podium.
Your name, please.
My name is Corey Degree.
And your relationship to Ms. Degree?
I'm her brother.
My brother.
Wonderful.
Sir, what do you have to add?
I have to add that for years, I've watched over my sister,
you know, the male figure in her life that she looked up to
'cause my mom worked hard for us,
and we had mostly everything we needed.
So it was kind of hard to see her go through that
because there was times I didn't even want to say things
about my father or about my father's side of the family
'cause I didn't want my sister to feel
that she had a hole in her because there was one.
And that's what... Like this photo,
if you think about it, it's almost...
Like, what if the test say he's not?
It's a little... It's a little embarrassing,
you know, to go through all that.
That's somebody working that hard just to...
Just to make some type of connection with somebody, you know?
You got her reaching out several times,
and then, he's dismissive about it, you know?
JASMINE: Childish.
I was there... The day she called him when she was 11,
I was right there, and I'm not...
I don't recall him saying to her or not,
but he hung up the phone on her.
AUDIENCE: Oh.
And that's not for no type of sympathy or nothing,
but he did, and my mother was angry about it, and she called back.
She was upset about it.
He said, "I need a... I need a DNA test,"
and he hung up.
That just explains what type of man you are right there.
JASMINE: Exactly, exactly.
Hold up, the kind of man I am...
I'm the one that reached out to come here
to find out to see what was going on.
That was for child support.
I still need to know.
You said... Prior to right now, you just said,
"'Cause they kept taking money out my check."
I got two other kids I took care of.
One more wouldn't have made no difference.
Oh, you're just saying that now.
LITTLE: Oh, man.
JUDGE LAKE: And so, if you knew for certain
she was your daughter, and you had those results,
how would life have been different?
She'd have been right there with me, like I got...
Like my kids have been.
I wouldn't have denied her.
You know, I would have took her in just like my kid,
showed her my family, showed her love,
had her come stay with me like my kids did.
You know, it's bad for both of us.
If she is mine, we missed out on a whole lot.
Now we grown, and I don't know how it's gonna go.
Where we gonna go from here?
Well, that's exactly why you are here
because the truth helps us figure out
where we go from here,
and I have that truth for you.
Are you ready for the results?
(APPLAUSE)
Jerome.
These results were prepared by DNA Diagnostics,
and they read as follows.
JUDGE LAKE: In the case of Degree v. Little,
when it comes to the paternity of Ms. Jasmine Degree,
Mr. Little...
You are her father.
(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)
That's my father.
Mr. Little, you really seem shocked.
LITTLE: I really am.
JASMINE: Don't cry, Ma, you my dad.
Give him a hug.
I'm not.
Do you want to have something to do with me?
You want to meet your brother and sisters?
I'm open to it.
All right, that's good.
JUDGE LAKE: Thank you.
Thank you.
This is an extraordinary girl.
She may not forget, but you can build from here.
Get to know her, talk to her.
Jasmine, I'm so happy for you, honey.
I know it's about, hmm, 10, 12 years too late.
I know you wanted the truth sooner,
but you have it now,
and I hope you feel better having gotten it.
I do, thank you.
JUDGE LAKE: Thank you for being here.
I wish you all the best of luck.
Court is adjourned.
(GAVEL BANGING)
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