It's my great honor and far more than honor it's my great pleasure to
introduce someone who obviously needs no introduction you are here to see him and
hear him listen to him, Sakyong Mipham Rinpoche. The Sakyong is my personal
teacher I can make no pretense that running this interview he is going to do
whatever he wants and I will be devotedly grateful and excited about that.
So this would not be journalism nobody seen tonight this will be obsequious worship.
I just finished reading the book in my hot tub at home
in the snowfall and I can say that I am ready to listen.
so without any further ado:
An author, a poet, an athlete, a father and a teacher, my teacher,
Sakyong Mipham Rinpoche.
Sakyong, thank you.
It's good to see you.
Yeah. is our sound okay for everybody?
So there's a lot of things you teach about as you travel the world,
why did you decide to write an entire book on conversation, on this particular topic?
Well good evening everyone this is my conversation: How are you? (Laughing)
I think it happened very organically you know I feel like myself as a medidator
the importance of meditation obviously I feel right connected to but
it can become very much just ourselves. And even though we need to sort of develop our own mind and heart.
We actually did a video on this you and I in my living room how the meditation
or spirituality generally, and your father wrote a whole book about this, can become selfish.
Yeah you know I think it was a very organic I feel like
meditation obviously it's great and I feel like the way the world is that there's also a
sense then we can tend to try to escape sort of isolate ourselves.
I feel like that you know we're coming to a really important moment or time in our history
as a human development and one of the most important aspects I feel like
is not just sort of our own sense of mental well being
but its interpersonal in how we actually begin to have a relationship with somebody else.
I feel like that very simple conversation, I didn't want to make it too deep in a sense. But I feel like it is deep
just a human interaction and I feel it myself, just as you have, it is enriching and powerful
and often conversation gets very sort of ignored. Just superficial talk.
But I feel like for many of us moments, brief moments and the deep moments we've had effect us deeply.
and it's a form of human empowerment.
And so it's not so much about the right decorum, even though that's a good idea.
It's more about just actually acknowledging each other.
So I have about 5 questions already. one of them is aboutright to quorum
you talk a fair amount about that in this beautiful little book and one
question I have is that being polite you talked a lot about good decorum and not
swearing or easy jargon in talk
it's not kidding they forgot to erase my name in the liner notes read this one
twice but often conversation often being polite can be faked so how do we be
genuine and have difficult conversations sometimes that aren't smooth or worn but
that can be important to have like an honest conversation without violating
the court well I think the court it is hard actually
so sometimes you know it's a situation you can express yourself other times you
feel like oh that's my family on you so it's just being sort of aware and
realizing that it's just I think they're really one of the most important things
about conversation is this we say hello you actually acknowledge and then and so
viewing noticeable way is it's just some of that connectivity so a lot of times
we have something to say absolutely so it's really the notion of how we so even
locally politics can be pretty no one's trying to listen or to say hello they're
trying to be right it's a very kind of aggressive thing and we're also
obviously all seen that nationally whether you're a Bernie fan and you
can't stand the Hillary people or the everyone can't stand the Trump people or
the Trump people can't say everyone else no one really is invested in listening
so how do you bring what you were talking about cut openness or bravery or
warmth into a world that is almost having two wars is because everyone's
tweeting at each other yeah I mean it's it comes down to simple exchanges
conversation I think it also comes down to my experience we're just doing
in different situations when they're really intense conflicts like in Chicago
like in Chicago that was just Ukraine just that intensity I love it it's just
people have not being acknowledged it's either way whether we agree or don't
agree it's just there some say somebody was not seeing or respected and then
there's system I think the conversation will be said a very human level
obviously the politics and dynamics we have our best people thinking about some
speed and so I think this is like what can we do when we feel you know what can
we do it as as a person who is reading the news or see the news as you mean you
know we want to connect in Turkey so that is something and I feel like within
that you know there's a principle of life and how do you do it I think it's
maybe somewhat simplistic but I think it can you have a popular quote I don't
know how much you google yourself
there's a promo that's been going on for your assistance in this by yourself
supposedly it's the internet so Lincoln could have said it for Gandhi but it
says karma is so basic like gravity you almost don't notice it's there and I
feel that way about conversation so we take it for granted and yet it can
actually create love and you talked about that in the book what do you mean
by a conversation can create love mm-hmm when I'm looking at this book of a
Masons function and it feel like they could have just noticed and I just
actually began composition so this is something very simple you know obviously
within a meditation that water into like another analysis but I feel like at the
same time it's like there's something that needs to be the basis environmental
so it's not one of the main things I say it's not necessarily what the
conversation is on but just appreciating human connected so I think that was sort
of like it is like areas like water and we get up most of us we all have to have
some exchange that can and I know a lot of times when the one he gets easier of
official in the hand a lot of times we remember one conversations were going to
bed with as good of that whenever it gets to the finish even though I said we
do a lot of help in speech they were so divisive but at the same time what are
the elements that we can actually begin to shift them and what can we do well
that's my question for you mangos if you have a I mean we've all had that
experience you have a difficult talk you yell at someone or someone attacks you
for something really very defensive and then you think about it for two days and
you don't even especially if you're not meditating or if you're a busy you don't
even know you're thinking about it but it comes up any gaps like a song that's
stuck in your head how do you turn that around
I think it's feeling feeling the heart of thing what you didn't do
and I fill that with a lot of you know communication I try to emphasize the
notion of just human feeling and a lot of times it is not the words to say but
it's kind of the energy you put out and so what is it obviously sometimes we are
we are strong ourselves so we can do things at the same time you know we all
feel and it's it's something we're all going to have difficult conversations in
life I think you just multiply that globally and then you get this intense
separation so I think your father said something like it's not enough to do
good stuff and lose to be a martyr you have to we have to do good stuff for
the world and actually when I read that in some book and it really stuck with me
how do we actually given that twitter and facebook comments and all these
things are set up to you know before you know it people are calling each other
racist or sexist or a snowflake or whatever it is instead of saying I
understand you feel this way about the NFL players or gun control or whatever
is on people's minds but what about these things
you know they're not set up for conversation they're set up for
grandstanding and so boughten how do we have this kind of love for the
conversation when well one of the things I've experienced is that we have just
had this general sense that somebody is in charge so as I meet people I think
you're in charge
we do you know that's one of the things
so healing strength it comes across in fact we begin to shift so when it's when
it's divisive and difficult a lot of people a lot of good people a lot of
elephant readers all here often say I'm just going to turn off everything for a
month I'm going to get rid of my I'm gonna
close my Facebook account and just get away from everything
read the news do you recommend that
something often does business
you know so you have to learn you know
and so I think as opposed to you know so that's the answer I was expecting and
that's the delightful thing about conversation is it's an open thing I'm
learning and I'm not hearing what I expected to hear but on what I expected
here is that it's hopeful to continue to engage but to find out like it's not
helpful to run away I guess well I can't want other things
when your questions was about I felt like whistling peace conference Vienna
we're talking about the ocean of peace part of it is that people think that
pieces a weak situation and the reality is as we know like if you're on a path
of enlightenment getting to Nirvana getting to the wait a minute hard work
which takes strength peace of self maintaining peace in a relationship they
wanted you need to be strong in the world you know your readers strength
strength testing makes the sense of how we can change otherwise naturally yeah
that's profound we talked about that in the book that peace is not a weak kind
of just a neutral thing it's an active it takes real in a comida like floor can
be fun well I think there was mmm a negative peace which is nothing Bad's
happening so therefore this piece and then it's a positive piece with strong
piece which is there's actually things that are actually inspirational they're
leaving on life and I think when things were bad they get a piece is good in the
sense we're just happening at the same time if we want if we want to actually
take culture move forward you need that strong piece we need a sense of
telekinetics intelligence it takes understandings so these elements I think
which were exploring here so maybe a few specific questions from things that
really stuck out for me one of my favorite moments was you're talking
about when I think when you first got married
we're sitting down with your wife and she would bring tea or be tea and you'd
have these endless conversations and you keep waiting for her to get to the point
yeah usually the funny one neither funny or profound what am i doing a lot of
people wondering the same thing so but you discovered something delightful in
those endless conversations with a no point yeah I mean that was one of these
fishes to the book was that not all conversation to the point physically and
I feel like I realize no she just want me to connect it like many people do and
as opposed to this has to lead somewhere I to learn something and so it's just
basic like just being in the space and appreciate and then you can talk about
anything government but if you don't have that then it has to go your way
what we have to get to the point and I think which is different because
sometimes we do need to pass innovation there needs to be time as soon as other
times where it's just even enjoyment and you realize actually in a relationship
you don't have those moments that's when you know breaks down there's something
just not and so part of like the coffee culture the tea culture sort of that
it's bad you know experience you know then you feel like I'm missing out Lucy
and that's that's because nobody's right it's transactional exactly yes it
becomes so and you said I think in that section talking about your wife and
those team conversation is one of the things the book of conversation
a little joke there I wrote a book about commitment and relationship so when
you're talking about your wife you mentioned this phrase every day in
genesee which is beautiful that we can have that obviously with her or maybe
not obviously it can be challenging with our spouses you talk about that later in
the book that you have to reinvest all the time in conversation mean being
interested in what the what's going on with your loved one for everyone who is
maybe in long-term relationships out there I think that could be a helpful
section what can help maintain the health and delight and inquisitiveness
in a long-term relationship like more than eight months maybe
there's a sense of experiencing life together which is kind of open up as
opposed to just yeah you talked about it specifically like with long-term
relationships there can be the certain boredom or dullness or heavy silence
sometimes so if you're feeling that what do you recommend doing before me since
before I went when humidity will stay it's boring and I said the only boring
thing is you sitting there so the important forces use
meditation isn't boring so you're just about to Vera said the relationship of
staying what who's born exactly and so I feel like there's a lot of things when
you project this is not interesting somebody else I've heard something like
that before I haven't listened very well but thank
you so you've also talked in a section about
fostering conversation with children could you say something about that well
I can so yeah thank you I think it's you know really this conversations different
depending like the conversation children you know it's feelings really important
because it's not just what you're saying is how you be in space this real sense
of being aware oh you are so there's a lot of conversations happening more
through body language and I think in that way it's slowed down you understand
and realize that you know yes you know that's it's a human being and you are in
sort of de facto teaching them how to communicate
we're helping bring that out in person and that is something that they learn a
skill that they learn throughout the whole life in so depending on how we
were educated or we deal with those issues in life so
it's a very important and receptive but certainly relating relating to them
equal footing is very important teachers who they are and really modeling
behavior like if you interrupt or angry they're going to learn something from
that or if you're on your phone or TV all the time they're gonna learn
something so on that note when you talk about this in the book part of the
reason I felt very timely I was walking over here from the triage on the way to
the bookstore and every single person with maybe one or two exceptions out of
the 20 or so people I passed on the street was on their phone or listening
to headphones and kind of just sitting around the world the kind of delight and
relaxation you talk about that conversation you talk about conversation
in a lot of different ways that it can be just connecting even nodding someone
across the room just connecting almost so with a lot of that going away a lot
of people are even in society in public are siloing themselves off how what do
we do to combat that I think obviously we're more connected Internet as ever
and at the same time this does not mean many people is saying you know they are
anyways more disconnected we have people every day
I'm sure others having one more conversation and connecting and so
there's a bit of like looking at the service this is and this is really not
about technology and doing it but this is also saying what human connectivity
has to keep their technical activities it's a tool for us like human
interaction it's almost like that that's what's so exciting for me reading this
is I feel like I realized that everyday interactions that everyday jealousy you
talked about can actually save our world on some level that our two weeks can
start a war or they can offer some listening or gentleness or or maybe we
get off our phones when we're walking a little more and run into people and talk
with people we haven't necessarily paying attention to and I think it's
making a world more liveable right and just like it's kindness it's just being
in a society and just like it's not so much it has to be extra
just the ability of the situation we all didn't see space I think what are they a
part of that you know part of the way in looking at this is also that we are in
training where's me pathetic tradition tradition is part of the Dark Age is
just sort of human disconnect if 'ti and black have just been one and so I feel
like this is just trying to say that once you shouldn't be ignored because
that's affecting our society and so one thing in the book most people probably
haven't seen it yet I think the boulder bookstore have two special orders just
have the books available tonight so most people haven't how to get is at the end
of every chapter there's a well what is at the end of every chapter and they
could offer one of them surprise thing know it's basically chapter Ian's their
standalone chapters and basically that it is at each the concluding new chapter
there's sort of a contemplation on a floor slogan that you know how you know
what how do you know conversation it's just a
point where you can begin to use it in daily life so I think I wanted to make
sure the book was usable and have a full and again it's really more conference
like oh right but I think also this little reminder I also like it so that
you know what happened and also like thing just there's elements in the book
where you can begin to use it as a tool
this yeah one thing I loved is there's a lot of talk about listening in here and
you said one thing which is particularly maybe for outgoing people are extroverts
at least that's how I remember it it's harder it takes more was it bravery
more confidence to listen than to talk
somebody's really listening this is
other times you know say if you want to be heard we gotta listen you know so if
there's an exchange going on which is different than just pushing the agenda
yeah you know I think listening there's a lot of sort of different listening
techniques supposed to feeling listening
control there's the control the conversation and basically you can say
this not true and you know when you talk to you know diplomats and things like
this someone will say oh they were a really good listener is supposed to have
just a good talker so it's like they're able to understand them that's part of
it because we're talking talking about talking if there's talking it's an SP
listening and so we are both participating and we all need to be
heard so it's part of the they're gonna feel
like this is more common sense than a certain spiritual basically hey that's a
lot of what Shambhala the buddhadharma are is common sense right it's not as
with some theoretical I think a lot of the trying to you know what are the
generation what we have to live and manifest and so maybe we could end and
then take some questions with just a simple takeaway question for all of us
well it's not simple hopefully it's simple for you which is how do we when
we leave tonight and we go home how do we create a little peace and peace in
the sense that you use it strong and kind of delightful you talk about
celebration and fun and it's not just you know a static piece how do we create
a little peace in our interactions this week whether online or impersonal
anybody theme and you realize you know life is really precious I think when you
just connected that the simple truth and a lot of things open up and I think when
we just get disconnected feeling sensitive preciousness of existence so
when we have difficulty then you know small conversations are the important
when things are going well it's like oh there's no big deal
so it's almost a week rounding our self like what are the basics of life and it
says and then peace from that point of view is going to be natural it's gonna
be the things you want to be able to contribute we're gonna have more
organically as opposed to it some sort of technique and so everyone is you know
no matter what mood you and it's like appreciate there's something and to me
that is conversation communicating with elements mitigating the nature of the
world and so I think when we get no no you know which is a feeling in the sense
brain or overwhelmed obviously so yeah I thought about so as I was reading this
my idea of what conversation was where they expanded because you talked about
how conversation like I always talk going to farmers market free therapy
like that can be depressed or burned out or whatever and I go there and there's
all these little interactions and people say hi sunshine and kids and dogs
I'm not dogs do you want abandon but
but something about just that walking through all this conversation is really
uplifting I guess a a final question I would ask is if some people find that
really draining like in Traverse how do in Traverse relate to the lost art of
conversation well I think you know this is you know the part of me that's terms
are like appreciating just as the quiet and you know like wanting to have your
space and so forth and then there's you know this time for that a lot of times
silence and just your being together but that say anything can be good
conversation if you're okay they're not just feeling the situation yeah they
call that the definition of love I've seen that quote it's very comfortable
being quiet to know that yeah and I think there's some wisdoms to us being
there at the same time part of the suppose when we get to internal tears
that we begin to lose perspective there there's something else there that they
have a feelings too says it's like an interest in natural kindness with
connectivity with compassionate once you begin to really as the other person has
feelings too then there's gonna be in natural just what's going on and asking
this question so doesn't need to be a hat you know technique and then that's
what I think it does become disconnected if you go
so that's and we can and we need to do that with people we disagree with not
just not just our friends and loved ones we need to instead of what I see on the
internet all the time it's just it one second any mark on each other racist or
sexist or whatever you know can we actually offer listening to
people we on some level regardless racist or sexist cetera we have to we
have to begin to live it I think it's part of this notion of how does that
change me him to take effect and if this see you related other people my way this
was decent and sinister strong and every come to the example as opposed to always
objectifying everything yeah you have to change you from going to change my
situation so I think you know we're all in a situation where when is the moment
we decide I'll do something that's often people will be heroes or some people
will respect us think I mean I trust we made a choice to forget for to see we
may not always do that every single day but we can have a few moments where that
begins to variations there was this fellow this on Netflix I think Darrell
Davis know I'm talking about he is a black man an african-american and he
goes around talking with KKK members and about racists and it's a documentary
about these conversations and he says I have no goal I'm not trying to change
their mind but he's converted hundreds of races to Lavina and who
you know he's doing way to them seeing everyone is human so I'd love to see you
to have a conversation so at this point I'd like to invite anyone for if you
have a question we don't have a whole lot of time but I think there's mic with
Stephanie and I have a mic so if you have a question just raise your hand and
all so with the current political climate especially older and someone
running for City Council I'm just curious for how do you speak
your truth how do you continue to fight something that you feel is so unjust and
you know yourself you so how do you speak that truth you hold yourself in a
whole bit what you know is right and what nature and mother earth and when
you see the big money and everyone coming in I mean geeks to you of
anything it's really difficult I feel like we're
both challenged you know I think especially intellectually I think it's a
very challenging time for everyone when I'm gonna wanna talk to you
there are spiritual leaders and the people religions and people who are
doing social transformation changes and you know it is very intensive and I feel
like part of you know what I would like to just express is that don't lose touch
with your own humanity it's like I think that's the heart of it don't lose
yourself into processes and how can you maintain your own
and I think changing your change is going to take you moving things a
certain way instead of tape it's a two-way street it's also going to take
time to insertion its identity perseverance and that perseverance has
to be here to live with it and how do you live with yourself
I maintain so there has to be I think that's sometimes where we get exhausted
or we get just well that's a big you know the burnout effectors really big in
this kind of activity so I just think we have to have some way
of nourishing ourselves and then also see things for your mind well you do
feel inspired about something begins you see oh I guess it's not all bad but like
here's something here's something and then put things in perspective in that
way and you know it's and then it depends on how big you want to be you
know it can you've actually put yourself in somebody else's position what are
they thinking that's that's a big stretch can you at least not know what
is the level in content and often when we try to apply principles to the most
difficult situation you know it's almost like physically we're lifting something
that I'm not sure we can physically lift so there's a mental hospital so part of
it is strengthening our kind of ethical and personal fiber so we're able to you
know it's bravery it's these elements and you know
as I sit here in the older bookstore you know this place is founded on my father
he left today he's lost everything he came to this small little town the
country
he didn't give in to you can you talk to these principles and that's like who
would have known was sitting here order no no training book on this including
you and the world we're all like caring which is important we got a character
and we can't lose that but we need more than just carrying Amina so you know
strength and we don't want to underestimate what humanity is because
we do have a lot of different spiritual traditions and meditative techniques
from I'm in attendance but we can relate to that and that's what I'm exploring in
this book there's a question online I could ask how do we deal with busyness
in everyday life we have one of our most popular articles on elephants total
busyness is laziness the notion that we is almost like our default go-to to just
be busy all the time because we want to do something meaningful so I think it's
a matter of being satisfied so when we're satisfied we naturally become less
busy and we just so I don't think it's in busyness and speed are connected and
so speed in time is connected so and as you know as you look at this with the
science of the whole situation is like to the certain degree time is really
mentally created we begin to compress time we're living in a society that
served the times were living and so there's a moment where we have to
realize that we're creating our own stress from that point of view and how
can we begin to redefine you know and you know mmm there may be times where we
just we're trying to survive so we have many jobs we have to be
goodbye and there's other times where they're just look for something that we
make us feel full fill the space yeah and I think that it's it's speed can be
a form of just avoiding something to just get to the next thing avoiding that
feeling then you talk about like avoiding and feeling the sadness or the
exactly yeah there's something and so I think it's a lot of it is just you know
one of these don't have to be necessarily negative like why am i it's
important ask these questions and why my genius and you realize when you meet
lots of people people lived in all kinds of ways and after a while we think you
can only live in one way actually some true that many different ways and it's
always amazing to see how that person actually accomplished wanted they're not
very speedy and this person you know you know they do accomplish on their feet so
it's like looking at how we can be planet is around Sinatra listened that's
great it reminds me of I just have a boss Jeff Walter
Shambhala National Center and one night I had me like designing some website or
something and I did I worked for like ten hours I was super proud I worked
until like 4:00 a.m. went to work it nine or ten or whatever I saw him and I
kind of brag about how hard I was working and he he didn't seem very
impressed and say so what did you accomplish sure
well thank you so much is there a pressing question one final
question anyone want to come for them how do you propose having the tech
conversations with people who don't have them I think part of it is you know the
deal with with the timing of the whole situation and you're trying to resolve
something my technique is essentially to not have any hope and then take it from
there and so far it's worked because it's pretty hopeless
and out of that you realize that you've given up not in a bad way there's
something released and then you can actually begin to see what's you know
it's hard because you want a person to change so much but they don't you want a
situation to change where they don't and that old can weigh on you you were
living in the world is if you take it over on every single person is alive and
so there's a certain and then also it's important to have your small successes
to have your little things that are if you just take on the big things all the
time and that becomes it could be wrong so it's balancing harmony
so by no hoko means dropping your agenda a little bit what if I look at you do I
see the finish line behind you or not are we walking together so most of time
we don't see you just see which we do that's your plan
getting transactional in a way you know trying to get your father to open up or
we have some goal even if it's well intentioned tough is a relative word for
some people it's less time and depending it's a very relative every day like
there are certain things that are rate of certain countries with a living
already tough situations other countries have less difficulty and those are the
people that's what they work it's another country we so tough situation
situation you know they're still in service memory so it's a very it's a
moving situation yeah I feel like when we are in a very challenging situations
like right now it's a very important to realize that the fabric of reality is
which means we just didn't notice it you know the instability of life has always
been there on guarantee or what it's always been
it's just now is just more visible and so we're just seeing you know real we're
having these it's that's that can be that can be moment where we wake up and
we were so the correction now there is
so thank you thank you so much it's an honor
For more infomation >> MAKE JOKE OF - DOSTANA PART 1 - Duration: 7:08. 
For more infomation >> Police: Shopper's World 'abduction attempt' did not happen - Duration: 1:37. 
For more infomation >> Chilly; Mostly clear - Duration: 2:25. 
Không có nhận xét nào:
Đăng nhận xét